Quiet Power How Introverts Can Dominate in Business with Stacey Chazin
Are you an introvert struggling to find your place in a world that often seems to favor extroverts? In this eye-opening episode, I sit down with Stacey Chazin, a dynamic leadership development coach and proud introvert who’s rewriting the narrative on introversion. We explore how embracing your introverted qualities can lead to personal and professional success.
Stacey shares her inspiring journey from grappling with societal expectations to becoming a fervent advocate for introverts. Drawing on her extensive corporate and nonprofit experience, along with her expertise as a Myers-Briggs Type Indicator practitioner, she offers invaluable insights on turning introverted traits into powerful assets.
Key Takeaways:
- The true meaning of introversion and how it differs from common misconceptions
- Strategies for leveraging introverted strengths in the workplace
- How introverts can excel as leaders and make significant contributions to their organizations
- Techniques for managing energy and avoiding burnout in extrovert-centric environments
Embracing Your Authentic Self
Discover how Stacey’s personal transformation led her to reject societal pressures and fully embrace her introverted nature. Learn why authenticity is crucial for both personal fulfillment and professional success.
Introverts as Effective Leaders
We challenge the notion that great leaders must be extroverts. Stacey reveals how introverted qualities like deep thinking, empathy, and strong writing skills can translate into powerful leadership abilities.
Navigating Office Politics and Building Your Personal Brand
Gain practical advice on:
- Steering clear of energy-draining office drama
- Communicating effectively in group settings
- Developing a personal brand that aligns with your introverted strengths
This conversation is packed with actionable insights for introverts looking to thrive in both their personal and professional lives. Whether you’re seeking to advance your career, improve your relationships, or simply feel more comfortable in your own skin, you’ll find valuable guidance to help you on your journey.
Don’t miss this opportunity to reframe your perspective on introversion and discover the unique gifts you bring to the table. Tune in now and start giving a heck about embracing your authentic, introverted self!
Connect with Stacey Chazin:
Website: https://ifactorleadership.com/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/IFactorLeadership
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ifactorleadership/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/i-factor-leadership/
Connect with Dwight Heck:
Website: https://giveaheck.com (Free Book Offer)
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/give.a.heck
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dwight.heck
Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Giveaheck
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@giveaheck
LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/dwight-raymond-heck-65a90150/
TikTok:https://www.tiktok.com/@giveaheck
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Chapter Summaries(Full Unedited Transcript follows)
00:00:02
Introducing Stacy Chazen: Leadership Coach and Introvert Advocate
Stacy Chazen, a leadership development coach and proud introvert, is introduced. She discusses her journey of embracing introversion and using it as an asset in her professional and personal life. Stacy’s background in corporate and nonprofit sectors, along with her certifications, are highlighted.
00:02:16
The Origin Story of an Introvert
Stacy shares her earliest recollections of being introverted, dating back to preschool. She discusses societal expectations favoring extroversion and how this affected her perception of herself. Stacy explains how she learned to embrace her introverted nature as an adult.
00:06:26
Understanding Introversion vs Extroversion
Stacy explains the differences between introversion and extroversion using the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator framework. She clarifies common misconceptions about introverts and extroverts, emphasizing that introversion is about energy sources rather than social skills or preferences.
00:11:19
Introverts as Effective Leaders
Stacy discusses why introverts can make excellent leaders. She highlights introverted strengths such as empathy, emotional intelligence, analytical thinking, conflict resolution, and strong writing skills. Stacy explains how these traits contribute to effective leadership in various situations.
00:17:49
Leveraging Introverted Strengths in the Workplace
Stacy explains how introverts can use their natural strengths to succeed in the workplace. She discusses the importance of preparation, empathy, and analytical thinking in professional settings. Stacy also addresses common workplace challenges for introverts and offers strategies to overcome them.
00:23:03
Introverts and Workplace Communication
The conversation shifts to how introverts can effectively communicate in the workplace. Stacy discusses the importance of preparation, reflection, and leveraging introverted strengths like empathy and analytical thinking. She also addresses how introverts can handle office politics and conflict.
00:29:19
Strategies for Introverts to Thrive
Stacy shares practical strategies for introverts to thrive in various settings. She discusses task batching, creating buffer time between meetings, and reflecting on personal experiences. Stacy emphasizes the importance of recognizing and leveraging introverted strengths rather than trying to change oneself.
00:39:03
Navigating Office Politics as an Introvert
Stacy provides advice on how introverts can navigate office politics. She highlights introverted strengths like conflict resolution and thoughtful communication. Stacy explains how introverts can use their observational skills and analytical thinking to contribute meaningfully in workplace discussions.
00:49:29
Personal Branding for Introverts
Stacy discusses the importance of personal branding for introverts in professional settings. She explains how introverts can leverage their strengths to build a strong personal brand without resorting to uncomfortable self-promotion tactics. Stacy offers practical tips for showcasing introverted strengths in the workplace.
00:53:30
Embracing Your Introverted Self
In her closing message, Stacy encourages introverts to embrace their true selves. She emphasizes the importance of recognizing introversion as a gift and leveraging introverted strengths for personal and professional success. Stacy advises against pretending to be something else and instead focusing on authentic self-expression.
Full Unedited Transcript of episode:
[00:00:02 – 00:01:09]
Good day and welcome to Give A Heck. On today’s show, I welcome Stacy Chazen. Stacy is a dynamic leadership development coach and proud introvert and is rewriting the narrative on introversion. Having grappled with societal expectations that favored extroversion, Stacy underwent a remarkable transformation. Instead of conforming to societal pressures, she embraced her introverted qualities, turning them into powerful assets that allowed her to thrive both professionally and personally. Now, as a fervent advocate and coach for introverts, Stacy draws on her extensive corporate and nonprofit experience, a master’s in organizational development and leadership, and a certification as a Myers Briggs type indicator practitioner, to empower introverts, guiding them towards self acceptance, fulfillment and success in the workplace and beyond. I’d like to welcome you to the show, Stacy. Thanks so much for agreeing to come on and share with us some of your life journey.
[00:01:09 – 00:01:12]
Thanks, Dwight. It’s really my pleasure to be here.
[00:01:12 – 00:02:16]
Yeah. I’m looking forward to our conversation to listeners or viewers. Before we hit record, Stacy was talking about the fact that she’s an introvert. And I, you know, interjected that I am one as well. Those that have listened to the show have heard me talk about it in the past. It is something you can elevate and get past if you decide to put in the work and put in the effort. It doesn’t mean that you’re faulty. It doesn’t mean you’re broken. It just means that you have a specific trait right within yourself that needs to be dealt with. Right. So love on yourself. You’re going to love on yourself even more after you hear everything Stacy and I share. And I look forward to our conversation. So, Stacy, one of the things that I like to talk about with people to start off the show is their origin story. It helps people connect with you and helps them be able to understand and relate. So could you do me a favor? Share whatever you feel comfortable from your earliest recollections, good, bad or indifferent, that helped assist you to get to where you are today.
[00:02:16 – 00:04:39]
Yeah, I would love to. Thank you. So my origin story in this space really starts when I think about it, back to when I was in preschool, probably about three years old. And I say that because as soon as we start being in social environments with other people, with other kids, we begin to get messages from teachers, from parents, from other people’s parents, that being more social, having more friends, playing with kids, participating is somehow better than wanting to be by ourselves or wanting to have some time with other kids and sometimes some time alone. Building a tower with blocks by Ourselves, rather than doing it with a whole group of kids. We start to hear those messages when we’re pretty young. And for me, I certainly didn’t know the word introvert when I was three years old, but I did know that I preferred to do those things. I preferred to have just a few friends or to play a game alone, to watch TV to when I learned to read, to read a book, to do a crossword puzzle, to craft all those things. And my parents certainly made a safe space for that and reinforced when I did activities like that I was a very strong student, which a lot of introverts are, and I got a lot of positive feedback for that at home. But socially, being a really strong student, not having a ton of friends, just having a fewer number of friends, and really enjoying being by myself a lot more than other people, you get negative feedback in social environments about that. And it wasn’t until I was an adult that I looked back on that and realized that I had been getting this messaging, this negative feedback to really the way that I’m wired. Right. We’re all born the nature versus nurture debate, but we’re all there some extent that nature plays a role in who we are, for sure. And the way nature determined me to be as an introvert was something that society deemed less than inferior to being extroverted. So that’s how things started for me. And it wasn’t until I started exploring my introversion and learning about it as an adult that I was able to name why it was that I felt badly about who I was and what my preferences were as a kid and as a teenager.
[00:04:39 – 00:06:25]
Yeah, societal norms are powerful, learned behavior that we learn from our families. As you mentioned, your family made it. You were, you were safe, you felt comfortable in that environment. Societal norms, though, when we go to school, our school system, you know, does its best job. It’s not the teacher’s fault. But the education system does not work on personal growth and development and explaining to people, you know, a little Johnny, little Sally, this is how you’re feeling, you know, and, and having. Maybe there is already books out there, but childhood books where it can illustrate the difference between introversion and extroversion. Or somebody that, you know is just the child needs to understand why they’re feeling the way it is. There’s books about bullying, there’s books about people, you know, going through terrible tragedies of divorce or loss of life when they’re young because of parents gone. But I think we need to focus more on that introversion, extroversion I’ve had people on as guests that don’t even believe in it, and which is fine. I want to hear why. I do. I do believe in it. But I know myself as an introvert. I’ve had to work at being extroverted and developed it based, you know, develop what side I’m going to present based on the circumstance. Like this show. Right now, I’m being more extroverted than introverted, or we wouldn’t be talking, or you wouldn’t be talking with me if we didn’t have the ability to climb above that when we needed to. So the thing I have, though, is first and foremost, can you, for the audience, explain the difference between the two? I know the difference, but a lot of people listening actually don’t. They think they do. So would you do me a favor in explaining the difference between the two and maybe give an example?
[00:06:26 – 00:08:41]
Yeah, happy to. Because there are so many myths about what it means to be introverted or extroverted. So I’d love to clear some of those up and explain. So I will share that. And you mentioned this in my bio. I’m certified in the Myers Briggs Type Indicator Framework, or mbti. And for your listeners, viewers who are not familiar with mbti, it’s the world’s most commonly used personality assessment, and it reveals what your preferences are along four different dimensions. How you give and receive energy from the world, how you take in information, how you make decisions, and how you interact with the world. So that first dimension that I mentioned, how you get energy and lose energy with the world, that refers to your introversion or extroversion. So people who are extroverted tend to be energized by engaging with the outside world. They get energy from being with a lot of people. Frequently they embody the phrase someone who thinks out loud. They like to talk through their ideas as a way of. Of working through them, and that’s what energizes them. In contrast, someone who’s introverted is energized by their inner being, their inner self. They get energy. They’re fueled by time spent alone, by time spent with maybe just one other person, or if they’re with other people, probably they’re only going to be able to do it for a more limited period of time before they start to be depleted. So it’s interesting that you said that you needed to overcome a little bit or lean into your extroverted side to be a podcast host, because what I’ll say is another way of thinking about that is you and I are just having this one on one conversation. You’re not engaging with multiple people at once. And in many ways, being a podcast host is very well aligned with being an introvert, I would say, which I think challenges common perceptions. I’ll say there are myths. So people think being introverted means that you’re shy, which is they’re not the same thing. People think it means you don’t like people or you don’t like to work or play with others. You can do all these things. You just do it differently. You do it by tapping into the strengths that are, that are typically innate to introverts.
[00:08:42 – 00:09:19]
I love how you brought that up. What people believe, right? They’re, they’re. And a lot of it again is from learned behavior, things that they hear, conversations they overhear from adults when they’re younger. It doesn’t matter if it’s about introversion or extroversion. We literally have a society that passes on improper information from generation to generation. And that was a great explanation. I really appreciate that. What have you discovered and teach that helps extinguish those individuals skepticism about being an introvert or an extrovert? And that it’s a real issue for many.
[00:09:20 – 00:11:18]
So what I teach is I use a framework called appreciative coaching. And what appreciative coaching is, is it’s a framework that guides people to identify professional goals for themselves and develop plans for reaching those goals all through a positive lens, relying on something that’s called their positive core. So your positive core is essentially the best of who you are as a person, including your introversion. So what I do is I guide people to reflect on peak experiences in their lives. So peak experiences are times where you felt most fulfilled. You felt like you really had the opportunity to use your skills, your talents and your gifts to contribute to the good, to make a difference, to feel good about the work you’re doing. And when you look at the different peak experiences across your life, what will typically happen is you’ll see some common threads about the types of things you did, the way you showed up, the skills you were able to use. So I’ll give you an example. It could be that, and these are some typically introverted gifts. We’re typically very strong writers, we’re typically analytical thinkers, and we tend to have very high levels of emotional intelligence. You might find that across your peak experiences, you’re using these skills a lot. And all the things that show up these common threads make up what’s called your positive core. What I do is I guide my Clients, then to say, okay, I guide them to identify what their positive core is and then to say, how can you use that positive core to work towards some goal you have professionally? So maybe it’s I want to be a motivational speaker or I want to be a supportive manager, I want to be a really dynamic salesperson, whatever it is, then how can you use all your strengths to achieve that goal?
[00:11:19 – 00:12:00]
Wow. I love that. Because those that are introverted, that are listening or watching, there’s always ability to climb out of your circumstances that aren’t necessarily bad circumstances. You just haven’t been coached or taught to look at things differently. I felt myself getting a pat on the back from you when you said that emotional IQ and the different things about introverts. Because I pretty much fall into analytical. My. I’ve been told to have a very high emotional iq. I’ve also been told, though I’ve been, I’ve been coached through it and stuff, that I’m very much an empath too. So. Yeah. Thank you.
[00:12:00 – 00:12:16]
Can I ask, can you think of sometimes when you think about peak experiences in your life, can you connect those to those, to those elements of your positive core, being empathetic and being analytical. Do you see where that showed up for you?
[00:12:16 – 00:14:10]
Oh yeah, I can see it. You know what, this is strange. I think about my children and because I was a lot of listeners and viewers that are. Have inconsistent understand, I have five kids, as I mentioned to you. But I got, I went from a situation of joint custody to having full time custody of them as a dad when they were, when there were some weren’t even teenagers yet. And I utilized, I took me years to understand why I was the way I was. Where I could sit down with an upset child, mostly my girls, right? And we’d sit down and just have conversations where I could see their energy deflating, like their negative energy or their overzealous energy. And a lot of it was because my emotional intelligence was a little bit, not necessarily I’m smarter than them, but I was at a place in my life where I had gone through those hills and valleys, learned to control different things and know what to say. The proper words, like wordsmithing is so important, I find. I don’t know if that’s something for introverted people, but I communicate at a different level. But I can. That’s a good question. I can tie a lot of what you were just talking about to just raising my children and also dealing with my clients. I’m an, I’m a financial planner. I’M in people’s stressful, happy, mediocre situations where I’m dealing with their emotional and intelligence and what they’re going through. And I do a lot what you’re talking about too. I do a lot of goal setting. I, I do a lot of questions. Not about money. That’s the end result. Let’s heal your monsters, your money monsters, your life monsters. Let’s work on that. Let’s, you know, maybe I’m the first person that’s actually listened to and they’re an introvert. Maybe they’ve been told that they’re an introvert, so they’re hiding intentionally because they don’t understand the gifts they have. So thank you so much for that. Oh yeah, they are gifts.
[00:14:11 – 00:14:32]
They are. And it’s not about overcoming your introversion, right? It’s how can you leverage, how can you tap into the gifts of your introversion so that you show up as your best self? Because I think this is true. Not just for introversion and extroversion, but anytime we try to pretend to be something we’re not, we’re generally not going to succeed.
[00:14:32 – 00:14:33]
It’s exhausting.
[00:14:33 – 00:14:54]
It’s exhausting. That’s right. And you’ll have some short term success. And, but, but on the whole, if you, if you’re trying to pretend to be extrovert or pretending to be something you’re not, you’re going to burn out and you’re not going to be as effective and successful and really happy as you are when you lean into who you truly are. And that’s absolutely the case for introverts.
[00:14:55 – 00:15:53]
Well, and I find with introverts, when we don’t like having, you know, you should have lots of friends. We grow up and we’re told you have lots of friends. Your circle of life is, you know, you know lots of people, but you know, the five closest people to you. Are you effective with those five closest people or are you always trying to add, Add more, please, more. We become people pleasers. I know that was one of my weaknesses that I’ve developed into a strength, still have character building days and moments where I have to work on myself. But at the end of the day, I’m just me. I am who I am. I’m. If I want to be labeled, I’ll take that label and work on it and know that I have two, three good friends, three, two, three good, close family members and we stay tight. I find I give more to them than if some of my clients or friends or family that are extroverts. They spread themselves too thin. Is that something that is just me seeing that or is that a reality?
[00:15:53 – 00:16:52]
That’s a reality. And what happens when you think about work and in your personal life as well, but when you think about work, when you try to show up in this typically extroverted way. So most workplaces are designed with extroverts in mind. Even the layout, if you’re in an open office, open concept office layouts, which are big these days, or there are expectations of collaboration, of networking, there are all the typical ways that we’re expected to do that at work are generally aligned with extroverts. And what happens when an introvert tries to do it is two things. One, we’re really not going to succeed because if we try to do it the way the other people do it without tapping into our gifts, and I’ll share in a moment how we can do that better, we’re likely not to be successful. And second, we’re likely to burn out because we’re going to be trying to show up in the world energetically in ways that are not aligned with how we’re fueled.
[00:16:53 – 00:17:21]
Well, that slows us down though. It really does. If we’re always trying to be somebody we’re not, it affects, it affects our, it affects everything. We come home from work, if we’re forced into an extroverted environment and we’re introverted, we come home from work exhausted, then we still have to deal with family. And if they’re extroverted, we have to deal with their stuff. And by the time we go to bed, it’s just like, oh, you know, it’s a, it’s a wipeout.
[00:17:22 – 00:17:22]
It’s a lot.
[00:17:22 – 00:17:48]
Yeah, yeah, it is a lot. You know, one of the things that I’ve found very interesting about introverts is the misconception that they can’t make good leaders. And I was reading your stuff and, and that really struck me you found that introverts can make excellent leaders. Why do you believe this to be true? And what characteristics make an introvert a great leader?
[00:17:49 – 00:21:04]
My favorite question. So first of all, I’ll say I know it to be true and because I’ll tell you, there are many strengths. So let me start off by saying, as I just shared, most workplaces, the way they’re set up, both physically and schedule wise, they’re designed to align with and support extroverts. But the same is true in how folks are recognized and rewarded and moved into leadership positions. So the types of characteristics and behaviors that typically garner the Feeling this person is cut out to be a director or a vice president or even the CEO. Most workplaces are going to look at traits that are common among extroverts. So being outspoken, thinking on your feet right as the expression goes, being able to talk to anyone about anything. Lots of extrovert aligned behaviors. But there are all these traits that introverts tend to have that are equally, if not more so aligned with leadership. And I’ll share a number of them with you. One we talked a little bit about already and that’s being empathetic and highly emotionally intelligent. So important because as a leader, having a high emotional intelligence, or an EQ as they call it, lets you tap into and be aware of other people’s priorities and needs. So you’re able to see what your team members need from you to succeed. You can see what their priorities are and you can support them to become leaders themselves so that they can show up as their best selves. Super important. Another thing we tend to be really good at are being deep and analytical thinkers. As a leader, you don’t want to make rash decisions when you have a challenge. When you have a task at hand, let’s say creating a strategic plan or crafting a new mission for your organization, you really want to be able to think deeply and analytically before making recommendations or decisions like that. Introverts are very good in that space. We’re also very good at bringing a calm demeanor to periods or situations of conflict. So if there is a disagreement at a meeting or your organization, there are parties within your organization that are at odds with one another about what the right path forward is. We’re very good as introverts in stepping back, taking in all the information, all the context, tapping into our emotional intelligence so we can understand what’s really behind each of the parties, spoken, needs or preferences, and then coming up with strategic and really, what’s the word? Ways to bring everyone together that are going to meet respective needs and that are also aligned with where the organization needs to go. A really important skill. And then the last one I’ll mention is introverts tend to be very strong writers. Writing is part of my positive core. And being able to write, whether it’s a memo, a motivational email to your organization, communicating your vision, communicating what’s behind decisions that you’re making, doing so clearly and in ways that are motivating and instill confidence in others. Really important leadership skill.
[00:21:05 – 00:23:03]
I like that. Writers. I don’t know if this is just to myself as an introvert, when I write, I’m the type of person, even when I wrote my book, I like to read out loud sometimes so that I can, you know, like I’ll read an email or a text and I’m not sure how it’s going to come across. Obviously we all read based on what our six inches between our ears, our emotional IQs at, at that moment. If we’re angry and we read a text from a friend that’s not angry, we can think it’s angry. I know myself, I’ve got to a point where I’ll, I coach people on, on a lot of this stuff and I’ll tell them before you send that email, if you can’t wait 24 hours, wait an hour, read it now. If you still feel the same way, wait again. And then, you know, I’ll tell them though the first thing and best thing I’ve done to myself is read it out loud. Not angry, just read it like a normal, hi Stacy, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Right. And just, and keep yourself, try to bring yourself to a grounding point of reading it until you can read it. Like they’d read it if. Depending on what mood they’re in. And it’s, it’s helped me a lot stay out of trouble. Initially got me into trouble because I would just like my emotional IQ would, would be low and I’d go to respond to somebody because something else was going on. It wasn’t even that issue. And I just learned to time myself out, read things out loud. Even my book reading, reading. I’d read paragraphs or a chapter out loud to see how it made my internal me vibrate. And I think to myself, somebody else might take it this way. Good. That’s what I want. No, I don’t want that. The next time we know I don’t want that, let’s change some of the words. I talked about wordsmithing earlier, so I don’t know if that’s typical of introverts. How have you found that in regards to how introverts write?
[00:23:03 – 00:24:03]
Well, I think that’s a very empathetic approach. Right. You want to, you’re trying to put yourself in the, in the position of the other person who’s receiving your email or your text. So I think that is very introvert aligned. I also think it’s aligned with the gifts of introversion as they relate to preparation. We’re very good at preparing and it makes us feel more comfortable when we prepare. Right. So one of the things, one of the myths about introverts is that we’re not good presenters or we don’t like to present. But the fact is, when you present, typically in a formal presentation, you have the opportunity to prepare. You’re not just sent up on stage in front of a. A room of 500 people or in front of a board, a boardroom. You have the opportunity to do your preparation and to practice. And I connect what you’re saying with the emails. It’s similar. You’re saying it out loud, right. You’re listening to how it sounds so that you’re comfortable with the messaging that you’re delivering and how it’s coming across. So I think it taps into preparation and empathy. I think that’s very introvert aligned.
[00:24:03 – 00:25:20]
Well, it’s all, it all ties together, though, from the being empathetic to emotional intelligence to being analytical. I’m loving this conversation. Those watching. I haven’t stopped smiling because I’m enjoying this so much. It’s just. I want people to understand that we’re worthy. I’ve heard people say, well, I’m not as good as John. He’s. He’s, he’s very outspoken. He’s very this and that. You mentioned that. But I know as myself everything you mentioned about being in that boardroom or being in that circumstance as a leader or even just a person in a group, I listen to everybody’s challenges and then I’ve had to develop that empathetic ability to speak my mind. Right. Otherwise, sending out memos or sending this or sending an email or text is not as effective. If you can really have your emotional intelligence dialed in and just communicate. I hear what all of you are saying. This is what I found. How about we deal with each of these circumstances in a very structured way? Again, back to analytical. Right. Having the notes like you talked about notes and I, you know, the people watch and I’ve. Anybody that knows, I’m very much comfortable. I need to have a flow.
[00:25:20 – 00:25:21]
Yeah.
[00:25:21 – 00:25:35]
So this just confirms that I am continuing to advance in my life and getting better in that being an introvert that I’ve known for years. But it just, it’s always nice to have reaffirmation, isn’t it, that we’re not a little bit of cray cray.
[00:25:35 – 00:25:36]
Oh, yeah.
[00:25:39 – 00:26:03]
So even the empath, pardon me, Even though the extroverted people that are listening. You have people in your life that are introverted or maybe you’ve been mislabeled and you’re not really an extrovert and you’ve been wondering why you feel discombobulated. And all over the place because you’ve been forcing yourself to be something that you’re not. Embrace and love who you are. You can be an introvert with extrovert tendencies, correct?
[00:26:03 – 00:27:00]
Absolutely. And it’s not a black and white thing. So you might have a preference for introversion as it might show up on your Myers Briggs Report or a preference for extroversion, but it doesn’t mean that you’re always going to act in typically introverted or typically extroverted ways in all situations or at all times. Right. So you can tap into, you can step outside of your comfort zone. And sometimes you might need to do that. And that’s a good thing. Right. You don’t want to necessarily always be more comfortable with your preferences in terms of engaging with the outside world or not engaging, as the case may be. You want to be able to sometimes, but on the whole, you need to have more situations that are going to fuel your energy as an introvert that are going to deplete them because when you don’t, that’s what leads to burnout and then you’re not in good shape.
[00:27:00 – 00:28:03]
And I love how you put that. A lot of that would have to do with us reflecting and having good reflection on where we are at and understanding our emotional. Where we’re at, our emotional iq or just like myself, being grateful or practicing gratitude exercise, which I do twice a day minimum. I find that I, it forces me to reflect on the good, bad, the indifferent, the ugly of the day, and allows me to understand, why am I feeling like that? I shouldn’t need to feel like that. Why am I, you know, what good did I learn from that so that I can get better for the next time or, or what did I learn from that that I did? Well, I didn’t get the, you know, they responded negatively. But I know in my heart, with my analytical mind and heart and my emotional iq, that I’m correct. How can I maybe better present that? So I always am reflecting. And I think that helps as an introvert.
[00:28:04 – 00:28:35]
Yeah. And to your point, going through that practice might reveal to someone that, hey, you actually are introverted. So, you know, someone will say, well, I like people, so it means I’m not introverted. Or, you know, I’m not, I’m not. Or I’m not shy, so I’m not introverted. Right. They lean into these myths that they, that they have in their head about what it means to be introverted. And if you’re not recognizing it in yourself when it really is the case, it’s hard to claim for yourself what you need to be successful.
[00:28:36 – 00:29:19]
I agree 100%. It’s at the end of the day though, how, how if somebody says to you, I’m an extrovert, Stacy, and this is why I, you know, I love people and blah, blah, blah. Do you, how do you, how do you respond to comments like that? Do you set aside a time to have a conversation with them after the fact or you have something that can be said to somebody that, that you know, oh, you’re extroverted, Dwight, or you’re introverted, Stacy. Life’s so easy for you because you can hide from people or you can entertain people, which, you know what I mean? Like the lack of, the lack of knowledge and confusion. Is there an easy way to communicate with people about that on the spot?
[00:29:19 – 00:31:09]
Well, I’d say if someone’s saying, you know, I believe I’m an extrovert and these are the reasons and that person’s happy with how their life is and how things are going, then I don’t think there’s a reason to try to convince them otherwise. But if someone is saying I’m an introvert, I know that I’m extroverted, but I’m so burnt out at the end of my work week, I have to work with people all day long. I have back to back meetings and I am just depleted. You can have a conversation to say you don’t even need to convince them that they’re introverted, but it could be to have them consider some strategies that might manage that situation. Right. That. Well, if you’re feeling so depleted, what are some things you could do to alleviate that? So for example, one of the things I recommend, I have a link I can give you. I wrote a short ebook about how productivity hacks for introverts because we, yeah, I’ve seen that. How can you do more in your workday with less stress? Right. And so one of the things that I recommend is to task batch. And for anyone in your audience who doesn’t know what that means, task batching is blocking periods of time on your calendar where you’re doing the same type of work. So a type of work could be administrative, it could be creative, it could be strategic. And the idea is to do the same type of work in a blocked period of time. Because when you’re switching between types of tasks, if you’re going back and forth between administrative, creative, strategic, social, whatever it is, introverts tend to be a lot more drained by that, by the, by the switching of the type of work. So if you can block it that you’re so you’re not doing so much switching. That’s one way to prevent the energy drain over time to prevent the burnout.
[00:31:09 – 00:31:38]
Yeah, I’ve seen that with people that you want. They take their 168 hour work week and break it down. I actually have a spreadsheet that certain clients will utilize or even I utilize where you literally like you say you do batch tasks. So from this time to this time as client calls. This time to this time I’m do not disturb and I’m dealing with emails or this time to this time is my power nap. Because napping is a good thing. Right.
[00:31:39 – 00:31:41]
So I feel that.
[00:31:41 – 00:32:56]
Yeah, I’m just saying. Right. I. People don’t realize that there’s things that you can do to ground yourself. Right. So I like how you put that a little bit of effort and if you’re not good at it, there’s lots of people that you can reach out to that could help you. Like Stacy. And there’s so much information, yes, Dr. Google, it can overwhelm people, but there is information about how to schedule properly. Right. But I don’t do anything over complicated. It’s just a simple landscape. 8 and a half by 11 and it’s 100 and it says an 168 hour work week. And this is what I’m doing. Oh Friday afternoons, this is blocked off for personal time. And you know what I mean. And it’s just. I like it. And I think a lot of people, if you’re feeling all over the place, it can certainly help you to schedule tasks and have block time to do whatever’s you. Because really at the end of the day, even if you’re an employee of a boss, as long as you’re getting your work done outside of that is you, you don’t have to answer to people. You can schedule your time. Oh, I like this. I like binge watching Netflix for two hours a night, whatever. That’s. That’s you, right?
[00:32:56 – 00:33:10]
That’s right. So let me ask you this question. As an introvert, do you also. One of the things I also recommend in that vein is trying to block some buffer time so that you’re not going back to back to back meetings. Is that something that you’ve experimented with?
[00:33:11 – 00:34:05]
Absolutely. That’s why this week’s been last week and this week’s been a challenge. I usually only record my podcast two days a week from specific times and I open up my calendar and initially as I mentioned, two Years ago, that’s. I had it all over the place. And I had to get to a point where, no, I’m only allowing one a day. And my calendar ties into my podcast calendar ties in my business calendars, all in there, too. I have an hour and a half buffer before. I’ll do a client call after this or something. You know what I mean? I need that because otherwise I am so drained. And then really, at the end of the day, I’m being unfair to the people that. Whether or not it’s another call or I’m just working on paperwork for a client or I’m doing whatever, I’m being unfair to them because my emotional IQ is low. I’m tired.
[00:34:06 – 00:34:11]
Yeah, yeah, right. And so you want to be fair to yourself and fair to the people that you’re working with.
[00:34:11 – 00:34:36]
Absolutely. So. But it takes time for those. For those listening or watching. Don’t think that we’re ever saying that this is just drop a pin and it’s easy. It takes effort, but the rewards are amazing. You know, you just need to find somebody that can coach and mentor you. Because no matter what information you find on the Internet, are you going to apply it? Are you sure? How do you know how to apply it?
[00:34:36 – 00:35:24]
And if you do apply it, I think what’s so important to your point is reflect on how it went. So try the task batching, try the buffers of, you know, between meetings and at the end of the day, at the end of the work week, reflect on how did I feel differently this week or on this day than when I didn’t do it? Did it help me preserve my energy, protect my energy? Maybe it did, maybe it didn’t. Maybe you need to try something different. But experiment and then. But be. But be mindful when you consider how it worked for you, what impact did it have on you? How did it make you feel? And I think it’s also helpful to reflect on how did other people respond to you? Did you see a difference in the way people are engaging with you at work? Are they seeing a difference in you so that you’re getting that positive feedback that this new thing you’ve tried has made a difference?
[00:35:24 – 00:36:29]
Oh, yeah. It’s important for us to reflect and look at whether or not the needle is stable or has the needle move forward in your life? Has that needle just been one baby step for the whole week? Oh, well, that’s a baby step. I look at the fact of my needle hasn’t gone down. I’ve had a successful week, and people say well, you’re just settling if it’s just stayed the same. No, I’m not. Maybe I had all these things go on during the week that you’re unaware of and I’m not willing to, you know, puke all over people and tell them, but I’ve been dealing with it on a moment by moment, character moment basis, whether good, bad or indifferent. And I’m just moving my life forward. And the needle didn’t move this week, but it didn’t go down either. I feel satisfied and then if I see my needle go up a little bit, I’m just like, yeah, that was a great week. Monday to Friday, all this stuff happened, but I had this happen that one day. And I honestly believe you can even people you deal with on a daily basis, you can have one person do one good thing and then, and the rest of the week can be trash, but they’re able to feed off that one good moment.
[00:36:29 – 00:36:32]
Yeah, yeah, that’s so true.
[00:36:32 – 00:37:00]
That’s how I am. I can look back on my week and go, it can be simple as simple. Like last night I had a FaceTime call from my 2 year old grandson, Memphis, and he’s, he’s, he’s been talking for a bit, but he’s still all over the place and you know what I mean, it’s just something like that. The rest of the day could have had character building moments that were just trash, but that one moment and then I’m thinking about it right now again and that was yesterday. You know what I mean?
[00:37:01 – 00:37:26]
Yeah. I think that’s so important too, especially for listeners here who might be entrepreneurs. Like you’re, you’re launching a business and, or you’re, you’re trying to run a business, grow a business. And the entrepreneurial journey is certainly, you know, ebbs and flows, ups, you know, ups and downs. With all that and being able to recognize, reflect on, recognize and remain fueled by winds like that or boosts like that. Really helpful.
[00:37:27 – 00:38:11]
Yeah, absolutely. It’s just you got to put in some effort that’s at the end of the day, you know, like they say, you know, energy in, energy out. Right. If you bring negative, you’re always going to get, you’re going to attract negative people, circumstances, everything around you you look at is negative. And it’s just a matter of reflection and realizing why did I think that way? And if you can’t answer your own question, again, coaching mentorship is huge. It can help you. Sometimes that person doesn’t even need to say anything. You just speaking it out Loud you figure out your own answer before they even have a chance to. And that’s sometimes all a mentor coach needs to be.
[00:38:12 – 00:38:15]
Yep, absolutely. I totally agree with that.
[00:38:15 – 00:39:03]
Right on. One of the things I’m interested though is office politics. You know, I’ve been, I’ve, I’ve been a consultant for years and used to have to deal in a lot of offices and the politics. How does an introvert steer away from. Because I found a lot of office politics not picking on extroverts were a specific type of personality set that were causing them. They were drama based because they were stuck in the hamster wheel of that negative emotional, not knowing how to escape. And introverts, especially if you’re an empath man, is that ever suck? I’ll just put it bluntly, it’s, it’s tiring. Is there any way that an introvert. Do you have any suggestions for an introvert to steer away from or, or participate in a positive way with, with office politics?
[00:39:03 – 00:40:39]
Yeah. Such a good question. So one thing I think is that introverts probably prefer to stay out of it. Right. To stay out of that. Stay out of the fray of the back and forth. Right. We tend to dislike conflict more than extroverts do. And it’s that I think where extroverts get themselves in trouble and can fuel those office politics is when they’re thinking out loud like they’re, they’re not giving thought to the words they’re about to speak or the words they’re about to type. Right. We talked earlier about how you read your email emails over and read them out loud. I think introverts are much more likely to do that than extroverts. So I think they stay out of trouble more than the extroverts do. At the same time, I think that introverts can use that strength. We talked about earlier about being really good at diffusing conflict because we’re good at sitting back, we’re very good at reading body language and nuanced communication to see how can we help to, you know, to quell the, quell the fire here so that, and offer some solutions that are based in thoughtfulness that we’ve given it thought, we’ve taken in the context, we’ve read between the lines, so to speak and we can offer up solutions. And what’s interesting is because we don’t speak up as much as introverts, when we do speak, we tend to be listened to more because they’re saying, well, Stacy hasn’t said anything this whole meeting or anything about this topic. Yet the fact that she’s speaking up now clearly means that she’s given it some thought. And I think it can carry more weight.
[00:40:39 – 00:41:34]
You’re crafting a better response in your mind. Like I, I’m the same way when people, I never realized that why certain groups of people, whether it’s on a zoom call and there’s 40 people on there, why all of a sudden when I speak, I’ve been told by people, you know, we, we look forward to you speaking. We never know when you’re going to, but when you are, it’s very effective. Well, I’m sitting there for that hour, two, three hour call. I’m writing notes and I’m thinking, okay, I, I want to say something, but I need to say something not just to participate so that people think I’m knowledgeable. I want them to know I’m knowledgeable because my response is well crafted and it’s, it’s meant to affect people more so positively and as little negatively as possible. Because you can’t please everybody. That’s extrovert. Introvert. Quit trying to please everybody.
[00:41:34 – 00:41:46]
Yeah, yeah. So what you’re describing is a very typical introverted situation. Right. You’re recognized. Well, if Dwight’s talking now, you know, it’s worth listening to versus people who are just throwing everything against the wall to see what’s going to stick.
[00:41:46 – 00:42:46]
Yeah, I just, oh, even you just saying that I kind of get my anxiety. That’s another thing. Anxiety is something as an introvert, I’ve had to, I still work on all the time because I can easily get anxious because I finally do respond. And then somebody in the workforce like I don’t have per se a job, but somebody at a site or on a call or when I used to do a lot of external consulting, you know, you’re just thinking to yourself, okay, this is what I’m going to do. And I had to get to a point where if somebody was negative about what I was saying, I didn’t get anxious and shut down. Because when I was younger, in my 20s, I would, I’d shut down and I wasn’t in. I wasn’t effective for others, but mostly for myself. And I had to learn, it was just a learned skill. I worked at it to know what was going on in my life, to not trigger those things. Can’t avoid it all the time. Those character building moments happen, don’t they, Stacy?
[00:42:47 – 00:44:21]
Yeah, and I’ll say, and I’ve struggled with anxiety myself and I think it’s not necessarily an introvert typical thing. But I think I’ll speak from my experiences and what I’ve seen in some others is that the types of things that drive our anxiety as introverts tend to be introvert aligned. So speaking for myself, I’m a recovering perfectionist. So perfectionism is a big driver of my anxiety. When I used to write so I put out blog posts every week, it used to take me, I used to work on each post probably for two months. I would put out one every two months because I was so worried that it wasn’t yet perfect and I was worried that people were going to criticize what I posted and tell me I was wrong or there was going to be some mistake. And that’s a typically introverted fear. So that drove my anxiety, right? It was that saying, perfection is the enemy of the good. You never get it out the door because you’re waiting for it to be perfect, which it never will be. And then, yeah, and another introvert, typical introvert belief is that we’re afraid to get something wrong because then we think people are going to take that as a sign that we’re not competent in some way. They’re going to extrapolate that to form an opinion about us on a much bigger scale. So. And then extroverts will have other things that give them anxiety. So it’s figuring out. You need to figure out what it is that you’re. That you’re worried about and use your strengths, focus on what you’re great at, what you’re good at, where your passion is.
[00:44:21 – 00:45:45]
Oh, it doesn’t really, really doesn’t worry. I coach on this because I honestly believe worry is a state of mind that we need to stop as much as we can. Because when you worry, if I, let’s say I’ll use this, an example, two, three hours before Stacy and I are having our conversation, I’m worried about, am I going to come across the right way? Maybe I’m not an introvert. Maybe I’m an extrovert. Maybe I’m totally wrong about my life and all of a sudden I’m just all fired up and I can’t focus properly. I need, we need to learn to quell that internal nervousness, that anxiety, whether you’re extrovert or introvert, and just realize that we’re all human. We make mistakes and just talk like you would talk to your own family. Be yourself. Be the best version of yourself. Whether the doors close, whether the door is open. Yes, you might be a little Bit more jovial around your family than you would be other people. But you’re still Stacy. People can still say, yeah, that’s Stacy. Home environment. Yeah, I can hear, oh, there’s Stacy in the business environment. That’s her. That’s great. And that’s what I work for. Just a nice stable. I’m always climbing in my life. A nice stable. This is who my personality is. I’m not phony, I’m not fake. Like me or don’t like me. I’m looking for my tribe.
[00:45:46 – 00:46:08]
That’s right. Oh, that’s. I preach that myself. Yep. And. And your tribe as an introvert aren’t. It’s not necessarily other introverts. I like to say there’s the beauty’s in the Alphabet soup. Whether it’s your personal life, your family life, your work life. When you’re with people who have different strengths, different perspectives, different sources of. That’s often where the magic happens.
[00:46:08 – 00:46:15]
Yeah, it’s. It is. And if you’re introverted, don’t just seek out introverted people.
[00:46:15 – 00:46:16]
Absolutely.
[00:46:16 – 00:48:23]
It’s got to be like a salad. It’s got to be all, you know, maybe you have some cucumber in there, maybe like some tomato or whatever, some peppers. You know, everything’s got its unique vibe. Everything’s got its unique ability. Everybody part of me has a unique ability to be the ultimate version, to live that purposeful life and not live it by accident. And I hope this conversation to those listening are watching helps you realize how unique you are. Whether it’s extroversion or introversion, we’re all unique. We can all have a little, you know, you get those pizzas and people buy two, three pizzas. It’s a party. And person takes a slice of ham and pineapple. Maybe they take a slice of cheese or pepperoni or whatever because they want to sample things. They want to have the flavors of life and a little bit differences. And that’s the same in regards to personalities. I love reading people’s language. You talked about that. I’m a earlier. I’m a person that is a people watcher. I’ve taught my kids that. My adult kids talk to me about that now. My daughter reached out to me. She’s in her 30s. Just recently she says, dad, I was sitting somewhere and I. And I thought about you. And I go, well, what. What did you think about? She says, I was watching people and I was thinking to myself, this is so interesting. You can learn so much by being a student of human nature. And when I’m dealing with somebody on one. On one basis. I do look at their eyes. I look at their body language. And people are freaked out because we had to wear masks, whether you agree with them or not. And I proved a point to so many people. I could still read people from their eyes, from their nose up, I could read them. I could read by the way they leaned forward, lean back, cross their arms, and it speaks volumes. And then be kind enough to say to that person, I just said something and I watched your body language change. Is there something that I can, you know, do better? Did I say something wrong? Is there something I can help you out with? Be vulnerable, introverted, extroverted. People want to know how much you care and not know how much you know all the time. Right. So anyway, and that’s.
[00:48:23 – 00:48:32]
And that’s what would set you up to be a great leader. Right. You’re using that empathy, that emotional intelligence, and that’s an inspiring, powerful leadership trait.
[00:48:32 – 00:49:28]
Thank you for saying that. I appreciate it. Because as I mentioned, I’m kind of selfish about who I have on the Give a Heck podcast because it’s usually something that I can relate to or somebody in my family maybe can relate to. And I just want to bring that knowledge to the world to let people know that we’re all great in our own ways and we don’t need to feel less than we are. Right. So this conversation has been amazing. We got a couple more things, and then we’re going to wrap up the show. I want to understand, though, so with personal and business branding, however, again, thought about how it affects an introvert. I was thinking about that reading yesterday through your stuff, and how does it struggle? Is it a struggle really for a person that’s introverted or extroverted for creating that personal brand? And why is a personal brand so important to be created correctly?
[00:49:29 – 00:51:59]
Yeah. So I’m going to answer your second question first. It’s so important because your personal brand, when you’re. When you’re talking about the professional arena, your personal brand is essentially when someone would say, when I think about Stacy, I think X. Right. So it could be. When I think about Stacy, I think of a highly empathetic, creative, strong writer. I don’t know if these things are true, if people think this of me, but I’m just using this as an example. Right. And you want. You want your personal brand, what people associate when they hear your name. You want that to be some. You want that to be traits that are aligned with leadership so that when they think of you, they’re thinking that person is cut out to be a leader. That person is a contributor, a supporter, someone who is taking us in a positive direction. And the reason that the idea of a personal brand makes many introverts uncomfortable is because we think of the typical shouting from the rooftop, self promotion, which is not aligned with, with being an introvert. And so the idea is again, going back to what your positive core is. How can you tap into your strengths to communicate and reinforce to other people who you are as a, as a professional, as a human and as a leader. And so one way you can do that, for example, is, let’s say writing is one of your gifts. Curate a blog, contribute to other people’s blogs with posts of your own, write memos, write a quarterly memo to your team, patting folks on the back and acknowledging contributions that different people have made. You’re communicating what you stand for as a professional and as a leader. So that’s a big way of doing it. Another way is to take advantage of time that you have with your manager, whether it’s a quarterly check in or your annual performance review, and come prepared with narrative about ways that you’ve contributed to the organization. So not just you want to be tying your accomplishments, what you’ve done, to how you’ve advanced your team’s goals or how you’ve advanced the organization’s mission. This is going to be. So it could be that, you know, Stacy or Dwight is a really strong salesperson. They’re really good at forging new relationships. They’re really good at analyzing data to inform our strategic plans. Whatever it is, tie those strengths to how you’ve helped the organization to move forward or to achieve its goals. And that’s part of your personal brand. What are you good at? How have you contributed?
[00:51:59 – 00:53:18]
I like how you put that. When they hear your name, what they associate you with. I had my personal brand. I started in 2020 during the pandemic of. And it was an introvert, very successful introvert that I became friends with years prior. That guided me and helped me. Right. It wasn’t an extrovert, it was an introvert. And yet I didn’t realize he was an introvert until we started communicating more and more on individual basis as well as group calls. Very successful entrepreneur in the US he has a famous brand and Tony and I just clicked and he gave me so much strength and he gave me peace too, that who I am is okay and there’s things I can work on, there’s things I can move forward. He and a Bunch of other people are the reason to Give a Heck podcast exists. The reason I wrote a book on how to live life on purpose, not by accident, and it’s just right. It was an introvert that did that for me and the other people that supported me along the way were introverted. There was the odd extrovert. But now when I think about these people as I’ve got to know them, I’ve met them at conferences or spoke with them at conferences over the years, they’re introverts more than I think they even realize. And it just makes me smile.
[00:53:19 – 00:53:19]
It’s great.
[00:53:19 – 00:53:29]
Love it. So Stacy, if you had to give our listeners one last closing message, what would you tell them in regards to giving a heck and never giving up?
[00:53:30 – 00:53:59]
Say, embrace your true introverted self. Think about your introversion as one of your greatest gifts and figure out how to tap into the strengths and true perspectives and value that all of that entails. Don’t pretend to be something else. Embrace your strengths and try to bring them to every situation you’re in. Look for opportunities to use them and it’s going to be your greatest pathway to success.
[00:53:59 – 00:54:56]
Wow, I love that this whole conversation has been a blessing. I seriously mean that. I can’t wait to engage with people after they’ve listened to this show. And yeah, it’s just, it’s confirmed a lot of things that I realized years ago. But it’s always nice to have affirmations and have people affirm what we know, especially people that are specialized in it, like yourself, that have become that expert to help other people through their own challenges to become the ultimate version of themselves. And that’s what I like too. Helping people live a purposeful life is. It speaks volumes. It feeds me in more ways than I can even explain to people that are watching or listening. So our time is up, but I want to respect our listeners and your time. What’s the best way that people can reach you, Stacy?
[00:54:57 – 00:55:38]
They can find me online@ifactor leadership.com so I for introvert and if you go there, you can learn about an on demand program I have called the Introverts Leadership Formula, which is a self paced program which lots of introverts prefer that will give you powerful communication strategies, ways to prevent burnout and protect your energy. And then literally, how do you ask for a raise in a promotion as an introvert in ways that make it really hard for someone to say no. So you can learn about that. I’m happy to talk with you. Set up a free introvert career strategy call and I also do private coaching so come learn about me there. Ifactor leadership.com awesome.
[00:55:38 – 00:56:16]
For those new to the show, go to giveaheck.com go to the top hit on podcasts. You’ll see Stacy’s picture and you’ll have the detailed show notes below including the full transcript as well as all the links that to Stacy’s social media as well as the website so you don’t have to pull over on the side of the road. If you’re listening while you’re driving, you can just go to giveaheck.com your one stop shop for finding information about the incredible Stacy, I really appreciate your time with us today. Is there any last final words you’d like to say before I wrap up the show?
[00:56:17 – 00:56:30]
It was such a pleasure learning from you as well today Dwight, and hearing about your path as an introvert. And thank you for your vulnerability and your openness with me today.
[00:56:30 – 00:56:57]
Yes, thank you so much. I look forward to our next conversation. I could easily see us having a second show in the future and discussing more. Obviously I wanted to discuss how to get the promotion and stuff. There’s only so much we can talk about in an hour, so I think we did a great job. I think we give people more than enough morsels of information to help them with that next baby step in their life. Or maybe take their first baby step.
[00:56:58 – 00:56:59]
That’s right. Thank you so much.
[00:57:00 – 00:57:13]
You’re welcome. Thanks again. Thanks so much for being on Give a Heck. Stacey. I appreciate your time and sharing some of your experiences so letters too can learn. It is never too late to give a heck.