Shattering Self Imposed Limits A Journey Beyond Expectations With Betsy Pepine
Are you living a life that looks successful on paper but feels like slow suffocation in your soul? In this eye-opening episode, I sit down with Betsy Pepine, a bestselling author, speaker, and entrepreneur who dared to break free from the metaphorical boxes that were holding her back.
Betsy shares her powerful journey from pre-med student to navigating divorce and reinvention. She opens up about the moment she stopped living by default and started living by design, challenging the limits placed on her by society, circumstances, and herself.
Key Takeaways:
- The importance of recognizing and questioning the boxes we’ve been placed in
- How to trust your emotions as signposts for needed change
- Strategies for addressing fears that hold us back from authentic living
- The power of redefining success on your own terms
Breaking Free from Expectations
Discover how Betsy:
- Overcame the pressure to follow a predetermined career path
- Navigated the challenges of single parenthood and career transitions
- Found the courage to pursue her true passions in real estate and writing
Redefining Success and Relationships
Learn about Betsy’s evolving definition of success and her insights on:
- The importance of authenticity in personal and professional life
- How to build meaningful connections while staying true to yourself
- Balancing ambition with personal fulfillment
This conversation is packed with practical wisdom for anyone feeling stuck in a life that looks good on paper but doesn’t feel right in their heart. Whether you’re contemplating a career change, reassessing your relationships, or simply seeking more authenticity in your daily life, you’ll find valuable guidance to help you on your journey.
Don’t miss this opportunity to challenge your own limiting beliefs and start living a life true to your values and aspirations. Tune in now and start giving a heck about breaking free from the boxes that no longer serve you!
Connect with Betsy Pepine:
Website: https://www.betsypepine.com/book
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/betsypepine/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/betsypepine
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/betsypepine/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BetsyPepine
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@gainesvillerealtor
Substack: https://substack.com/@betsypepine
Connect with Dwight Heck:
Website: https://giveaheck.com (Free Book Offer)
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/give.a.heck
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/dwight.heck
Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/Giveaheck
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@giveaheck
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dwight-heck-65a90150/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@giveaheck
X: https://x.com/give_a_heck
Chapter Summaries(Full Unedited Transcript follow):
00:00:02
Breaking Free from Societal Expectations: Betsy Pepin’s Journey
Betsy Pepin shares her journey from pre-med student to successful real estate entrepreneur. She discusses breaking free from family expectations, navigating divorce, and finding her authentic path. Betsy emphasizes the importance of challenging societal norms and living life by design rather than default.
00:31:43
Redefining Success: From External Validation to Personal Fulfillment
Betsy explains how her definition of success evolved from seeking promotions and accolades to focusing on enhancing others’ lives daily. She discusses creating a nonprofit and measuring success by her positive impact on others, highlighting the shift from external validation to personal fulfillment.
00:58:36
Identifying and Overcoming Limiting Beliefs
Betsy offers advice for those questioning their life choices. She emphasizes the importance of recognizing emotions, trusting feelings, and addressing fears holding people back. Betsy encourages listeners to explore boxes no longer serving them and take steps towards living a more authentic life.
Full Unedited Transcript
[00:00:02 – 00:01:50]
Good day and welcome to give a heck. On today’s show, I would like to welcome Betsy Pepin. Here’s a little bit of information about Betsy you may not have realized what if the life you built on paper looked like success, but in your soul it felt like a slow suffocation. Betsy has their credentials, the career, the outward wins. But something inside her whispered there’s more. In this episode she opens out about the moment she stopped living by default and started living by design. Betsy is a best selling author, speaker and entrepreneur who walked away from the past others expected and carved her own. From a pre med student to navigating divorce and reinvention, she choose to break free from metaphorical boxes that bind us and keep a small. Her book Breaking Dismantling the metaphorical boxes that bind Us has become a lifeline for those ready to challenge the limits placed on them by society, by circumstance and by themselves. As she writes, boxes aren’t always square and some are cleverly designed to keep us confined. She went on to build multiple businesses including Pepin Realty and founded Pepin Gives, a nonprofit that supports fast families facing housing insecurity. With the support of her mentor Barbara Coran. Betsy’s journey is proof that when you stop living on autopilot and start giving a heck about your purpose, everything changes. If you’ve ever felt stuck in life that looks good but doesn’t feel right, this conversation might be just a wake up call. But didn’t know you needed. Let’s get into it. Good day. How are you doing, Betsy?
[00:01:51 – 00:01:53]
I’m doing great, Dwight, thanks for having me.
[00:01:53 – 00:01:57]
No problem. And I apologize to Barbara pronounce your last name. I.
[00:01:58 – 00:02:02]
That’s one thing I forgot to practice Corcoran there.
[00:02:02 – 00:02:48]
Thank you, Corcoran. And anybody that’s watched Shark Tank knows, knows who she is. She’s quite the amazing person actually. I quite enjoy following her on social. But anyway, so at the end of the day, I like talking about a person’s origin story to start this all out, you know, to find out the good, bad, the indifferent. Sometimes it’s great, sometimes there’s a little bit of hills and valleys and sometimes when we hit adulthood we realize and look back that there was a deciding or multiple deciding factors that helped us shape into who we are today. So you do me a favor Betsy, and please tell me your origin story and the things that have happened in your life that have gotten to where you are today.
[00:02:49 – 00:07:46]
Sure. I would say the first thing is I was born a identical twin and I think that definitely has Impacted my life probably more significantly than anything. Having somebody, a carbon copy of me always by my side and having a built in best friend has been just beautiful for me. But I was born of one of three kids, three daughters. We, we were born in Philadelphia, then we moved to Gainesville, Florida. My father is and still practicing at 84 years of age. He’s a practicing cardiologist at the University of Florida. And as a result of that, my sisters and I watched him very passionate about his career and his academic work and research and volunteered with him in the hospital and was really, we, my parents kind of teed us up to all be physicians like him. And that was very meaningful in my life. You know, I definitely felt that there was a lot of expectation for me to follow this path as well as my sisters. And the path was laid out for us. My parents did a very generous job of creating opportunities for us both in terms of opportunities in the medical field as well as educationally, to be able to pursue that if we wanted. My two sisters did go on. They were pre med, we were all pre med. We all went to the same college. We were all pre med. And then they went on to become physicians. I did not. And, and that was, that was really difficult for me just internally because I did feel so much pressure and I felt like I let the family legacy down. Not pursuing that path. I really knew that that was not. In my heart. I knew I would not be happy. But it, it took literally a decade to get over that feeling of dis, you know, disappointing the family and letting them down. But I pursued a degree in business and went on to business school and pursued, interestingly, a career in the pharmaceutical industry. I think in hindsight to kind of balance the fact that I had decided not to pursue a career in medicine, but at least I would stay in the healthcare profession. It wasn’t something that I was particularly passionate about, but it, I was, I was attracted to the other things that that career provided me. It was a great career in terms of income and benefits for the family. I was the primary breadwinner when I was married. I had two young daughters. I had a lot of time at home. I didn’t have to take a lot of work home at night. I didn’t have to travel that often. So I kind of liked everything, all, everything the job provided, except for the actual work of that I did every day. And so that was, that was definitely a conflict for me. I felt a little bit disingenuous. Not, you know, really, I don’t want to Say, caring, but not really feeling much emotion if, if patients and healthcare providers used our products. And that. That was definitely hard for me to do. So. 10 years in, I was 30. Well, about nine years in, I was 31. I got. I got. I went through a divorce. My children were 1 and 2. And in a very short period of time, I was also laid off. I was involved in a corporate restructuring of a pharmaceutical company that I was at and had never, ever been laid off before and never without a job. I mean, I’d been working since I was very little. And I think those two events, because they happened so close together and they were fairly significant in my life, it just made me pause, you know, put my life on pause and reevaluate what path I was taking. And what was this, the direction that I really wanted to continue. And I ended up moving back home. I was living in the Northeast at the time, and I moved back home and regrouped. It took me a couple years to figure out what I wanted to do. I did consulting while I was figuring it out, but I ultimately decided to pursue real estate as a career. That was something that I had dabbled in in the past. I’ve loved it. My parents had always had different investment properties growing up. I saw them having and enjoying alternate or multiple sources of income. So I thought I would give it a try. And I did. And that was about 20 some years ago. And I fortunately loved. I mean, I knew I would like it, but I didn’t realize how much I would enjoy it. And I truly love it. And so I’ve been working in that industry for the last 20 years. So that’s. That’s my origin story in a nutshell.
[00:07:46 – 00:08:32]
Well, that’s great. Thanks for sharing. So you went from you not wanting to deciding that the doctor stuff. I hear this a lot of time. I went through it myself. We feel like we have to follow the path or the expectations from our parents to do different things. So you decided not to go to. Through finish pre med, went into business to work in the medical industry. You know, it’s full circle because you’re still being a people pleaser, you’re still trying to please the family. And I like how you were honest about the fact that you really weren’t. It wasn’t your niche. You were doing it. So when the corporate restructuring happened, was that the moment that you realized that you were living in somebody else’s expectations or had it creeped up on you and you just kept on pushing it back?
[00:08:33 – 00:08:47]
No, it was definitely. I kept Pushing it back wasn’t something that was like a light switch. I, I definitely felt it, but, but had I not been laid off, I would still be in that industry.
[00:08:48 – 00:09:46]
Yeah, so, so you were blessed. And some, you know, in many, many ways things happen for us, not to us. And people just don’t understand that. That’s, that’s hard for us as adults as we grow up, especially trying to teach younger adults. Right. Yeah, there’s, there’s something around the corner. There’s a reason that didn’t work out for you. And, and many people, when they can seek that out, have that much better of their next story, not even their next chapter, the next story of their life. So thank you for sharing that. That foundation of your life, the beliefs you inherited and questioned early on, is so connected to the heart of your book. From what I’ve been reading, obviously I haven’t had a chance to read your book. You become a champion of helping others recognize the invisible limits they live within. Let’s open that, let’s open that up a bit. Your book Breaking Boxes is such a powerful metaphor. What inspired you to write this book and what do you hope readers take away from it?
[00:09:49 – 00:12:37]
What inspired me to write the book was I’m 56 and in my late 40s, I was recognizing that I was growing increasingly discontent with my life. And it did take a good year for me to even admit that to myself. I didn’t feel like I had the right to be unhappy. You know, we, we, we are so blessed. Most of us are so blessed. When you look at the whole world in general and I, I just didn’t feel like I had the right. On paper it looked like I had a great life. So it did take me a while to, to admit that, but once I admitted that to myself, I went on a journey of self discovery and to uncover why or what the source of this unhappiness was. And I explored, and still continue to explore different, different modalities, including meditation, yoga therapy, emdr, bioenergetic work, breath work, a whole journaling, a whole host of things. And what I uncovered, the common thread was that this, this feeling of being confined. And I, I relate it to. If you’ve ever had the misfortune of ordering a bed mattress from Amazon, it arrives at your door in a box and you, you lug it in from the porch and you, you know, you, you open up the box and you’re thinking they sent you the wrong thing because how in the world could this king size mattress fit in this small box? And lo and behold, two days later, there’s a mattress in your, in your living room that’s expanded to the size that it was meant to be. And I felt that I was that mattress in that box and feeling like I had so much more in me that was, but, but something was, was keeping me, was holding me in and contained. And so then I wrote the book because when I started sharing my stories with others, they would share their stories with me. And I understood this to be a universal theme with, with, with you know, humans, some of us more advanced and along the path than others and, and a lot of people wanting help identifying the boxes that are holding them back. And then once we have the awareness, how do we negotiate them? Are they, are they truly serving us? Did they ever serve us? And if they’re no longer serving us, why are we choosing to stay in them? So that’s why I wrote the book. My goal was really if I could help one person identify one box that is no longer serving them and give them the courage and the tools to extricate themselves from that box, I will have that will. That’s what I want. That was my purpose. So that is why I wrote the book.
[00:12:38 – 00:14:15]
That’s amazing because I know when I wrote my book it, it was based on obviously things I’ve gone through. Valley to spare to highs and you know, the highs and lows of life. And it camp mentally and sometimes physically and we forget to climb and we’re always living on expectations of others. And I think it’s amazing that you used the fact of again, people listening hopefully caught that. Remember she started pre med, went to business working in the same industry as her siblings and her, her father and then pivoted and realized because of a corporate downturn that she can now do what she wanted to do and, and moving forward of that now bringing into the world a box, a book about, pardon me, breaking boxes is just amazing because so many people are afraid to be vulnerable with society about their challenges and their character building moments and really at the end of the day to be a person that heals and then helps others is a, is fantastic and I’m proud of you. And I, and I say that to people because I had to learn that centered, self, centered growth myself that I had to work on me in order to serve others. And once I had those realizations, why wouldn’t I want to share that? To collapse time frames for others. So congratulations. That is amazing. Is there any one thing that you could share as to why people stay in their boxes so long when they no longer serve them.
[00:14:18 – 00:14:54]
Well, there’s a couple things. One is you cannot get out of a box you don’t know you’re in. So the first thing is there are, there’s a subset of people and myself, I clothe myself in this, that aren’t even aware of some of the boxes that are holding them back. But then once we’re aware and we find ourselves still in them when we know they no longer serve us, it’s usually a fear based response, you know, a fear of failure, a fear of change, or a fear of loss. Those are the three main fears that I have found. Keeps us in boxes that no longer serve us.
[00:14:55 – 00:15:07]
Wow. What are some of the boxes? Are they defined by anything? Like, could you say like what are typical boxes that people tend to put themselves in? Would you mind discussing that?
[00:15:08 – 00:15:10]
Yeah, there, I mean there’s so many there.
[00:15:10 – 00:15:12]
We don’t have to share them all. Just share what you feel comfortable.
[00:15:13 – 00:17:21]
Yeah, no, but I mean the more you get into this, the more you realize they’re everywhere. And it, because we, we’re humans and we have the ability and, and, and it’s a blessing that we are able to categorize information and assimilate so much information so quickly. But because of that we have to, to simplify things, we have to categorize things into boxes. I think it started, you know, we’re hunter gatherers and, and I’m sure back in the day the very first boxes were, this is a threat to my, my life and this is not good or bad. Right. And so, and then it just built from there. A lot of the boxes that I see are revolve around the roles we play. So whether it’s the mom, the father, the, the wife, the daughter, you know, what does it mean to be a good daughter or a good wife or a good mom? Those are very common boxes. Roles around our religion. You know, certain religions there’s certain expectations. If you are a. I’m a Catholic, if you’re a Catholic, you must be X or you must, you know, I’m. People stereotype and think I must believe certain things because I go to a Catholic church. So religion is one. Our industry could put us in certain boxes. Our gender for sure, absolutely puts us in boxes. Sexual orientation puts us in boxes. I mean there’s just, it goes on and on. I mean our, our personality traits. You know, I’m, I am by nature an introvert. People really understand introversion and extroversion, I have found. And, and when they hear that I’M an introvert. They make certain assumptions about me that are not at all true. But it’s, it’s, you know, you see, the minute we slap a label on someone or ourselves, the more is assumed than just what that label might mean. And we can become stuck in those labels. So those are some of the common boxes, but I mean, they’re, you know, family of origin boxes are big like the, the box.
[00:17:22 – 00:17:24]
Yeah. Learned behaviors are so strong.
[00:17:25 – 00:18:19]
Yeah, they are. You know, I was talking to a gentleman the other day on a podcast and I was asking him, like, what, what boxes did he face? And he, he said his family of origin box he felt like was in his family. The first born son in every generation was named John. So like John the first on the second, John the third, all that. So he had like John the fifth or he had the first son and it was John. And he had to break it to his family that he was not going to follow tradition. And that caused a huge break in the family communication for over a month because he didn’t want to carry on that tradition. And I was like, wow. Like, that’s a, that’s one I have never experienced personally, but I could see the pressure in that. So we all have. Regardless of what family you’re born into, there are certain things, there are certain boxes that your family has placed on you by nature of being born in that ecosystem.
[00:18:19 – 00:18:49]
Oh yeah. The expectations we put on ourselves that the people above us put on us. People that even passed away within our family tree, like you were saying, putting pressure on us. Name this kid this. Name this kid that I was, you know, like my family wanted me to me to take over my dad’s business. I was the only boy, two older sisters, very, very good entrepreneurial business. Right. In my home community, it was only 10,000 people dealing with the rural community. Farmers.
[00:18:49 – 00:18:50]
Yeah.
[00:18:50 – 00:19:52]
But it wasn’t my calling. And I still remember the conversation I had with my dad. Oh my goodness. And I could see his heartbreak. He didn’t show it on his face, but I could see it in his eyes. Right. He’s a very staunch. He was one of 18 kids. So he learned, he learned to control his emotions. My mom was one of nine, so yeah, so just the expectations of, you know, I like how, I like how you talk about it though. It’s the boxes people talk about, you know, framing. What are you framing things and reframing and they talk about, you know, I always talk about it with people. Yeah, we compartmentalize. I don’t use the word boxes, but we compartmentalize, we step it back and, and the long term consequences is something I’d like to ask you about. What is the long term consequences of us constantly doing that? Having everything in a box, this stuff down. I know myself personally the part of the answer that bets everything, not just your, it affects your health, your relationships. But could you talk about that and what your experiences have been?
[00:19:52 – 00:24:36]
Yeah, I mean, affected myself my sense of like self worth. Because when I decided not to be a physician, I very much felt, and whether it was real or imagined, it felt very real to me. I felt like I had been. I, I was knocked down a couple pegs in the, the hierarchy or not even hierarchy, but the value in my family. I definitely felt that I was almost like, you know, the Scarlet Letter A, you know, Hester Prynne. I felt like I was no longer respected as much as. Because my two sisters became physicians, they married physicians. So I was really the only one that was not medical. And growing up in our family, being a physician was, we were told it was, I mean truly like second to God. I mean this was the most esteemed thing you, you would want, so why wouldn’t you obtain it? And, and, and we were told the only reason why people aren’t physicians is because they, they couldn’t hack it. Like they, you would never not choose to be one, but it’s just because you couldn’t, you couldn’t maybe make it academically. And so I really felt less than for a long time. And so it did affect my self, my self esteem for decades really. But I think it’s just, but even if it doesn’t affect people’s self esteem, I just think it’s, it’s, it’s, it limits the potential that you see in people. You know, I remember and, and what this also has done is it’s called out how often I have put people in boxes, you know, unknowingly or not, not intentionally and meeting no harm, as simple as I was talking to a girlfriend one day and, and we were having, she was over at my house and she had to leave because she was going to a dinner party. And she said that this dinner party, it’s a, it’s a rotating dinner party and it was a club where they pick a country every month and they meet at somebody’s house and then they bring food and wine that is representative of the country. And I was like, oh, that’s really cool. You know, whose house is it at? And she said father John’s. And I, I was like, father John? And she’s like, yeah. I’m like, father John, the, the priest, St. Francis. And she’s like, yes. And so, I mean, I was very surprised. But then I said to myself, why am I surprised? The only thing I know about Father John is he’s a priest. Right. I didn’t know he loved wine, but I assumed in my mind for some reason that that’s not something a priest would do. I wasn’t like judging it. It was more just like very surprised. And it’s like, why am I surprised? I know nothing about this guy. Right? So we just make these assumptions based on very little information and we, we truly stop. See, like there’s this idea that. And I, I see it in my, I saw with my. Raising my children, the minute you label something, you stop seeing it. And so the example is, you know, I’m walking my children through a forest and we were, we actually did this on a regular basis when they were very little. And I would point out all the different trees and the leaves on the trees and the different shapes of the leaves and the different colors. And we have pine needles here as well as, as normal leaves here in Florida. And they were so enamored by this, this thing that we did every, on every walk. Well, then when I started teaching them, you know, this is a tree. I remember the day Maria would pull my hand and she’d say, mom, come on, we know it’s just a tree. So it’s like the minute you give something a name, they assume they know that. They know what the concept of a tree is. We don’t need to explore it further. And that’s what we do with people. I think once you slap a label on somebody, oh, they’re a cop, they’re a, they’re a priest, they’re an ex, they’re whatever, you know, they’re an introvert, whatever word you’re going to label somebody, then you assume so much more about them and you. The curiosity almost stops because we think we understand everything there is to know and we know very little. So I think that’s the long term harm of putting people in boxes. We know very little about them.
[00:24:36 – 00:27:40]
Oh, absolutely. Like the generational labeling, it just has to stop. It really does. And I look at the fact of. Oh, you know, you talk. And by the way, I’m Catholic too. I’m a practicing Catholic. Right. Doesn’t make me a good person. You can stand in a church and not be a good person. You can stand in a garage. You’re not a car. Right? You Got to. You got to. You got to have actions. You got to have things that you portray to people. And we get labeled by associations. So here’s what I mean. People listening, watching, on YouTube, go to conferences. I’ve been to hundreds of them, right? Sometimes speaker, sometimes an attendee. Sometimes it’s a educational conference. Sometimes I have to be there because of my industry and what I do. And people will come up to me and say, oh, I hear this, this, this, and that about you. And I go, oh, really? So they’ve automatically. They don’t know anything about me. They’ve labeled me and put me into a box based on the conversation. They’ve had one or others. Those listening or watch don’t do that. So here’s what I suggest. I go up to people and I introduce myself and I take the preconceived stuff that people have told me that I’ve read. Maybe I’m meeting Betsy, I’ve read about and never talked to her. And I give them a modicum of respect and, And. And treat them like a discovery. I want to discover who this person is, not about what they can do for me. And that’s something you have to practice to put yourself back and listen, be a good listener and discover what that person is. You can take what you’ve been taught about them, but don’t you dare put somebody into a box until you actually research and have a conversation with them. So anyway, I’ll get off my soapbox, right? You need to. You need to not label one another. You’re right, though. Like, my. I’m good friends with priests, many of them, and they like sitting back. I know priests that like playing cards. They like drinking. They like. They like drinking. Not just wine. They like, take. You know, my. My dad and mom growing up in a small community, used to invite the priest over. And one. One of them just absolutely loved having a drink of scotch with my dad. Another one liked whiskey. And I have a little kid one. Huh? What? This isn’t what I’m taught in Catholic school. Like, isn’t that, like, wrong? Yeah, but you know, my dad, I said to him, I said, what father Such I wasn’t very old drinks after they left. Well, yeah, he’s a human being, right? Nowhere in the Bible does they say they can’t drink. Jesus offered, like, look what he did. Look what he did for the wedding. Creating the wine. Like, come on. Do I think about it? Like, he was trying to tell me, like, you learn this stuff, but actually don’t just listen, analyze, make Your own? Yeah, you know, you make your own decisions. So I like that you shared that. That is so good. Anything else you like to add before I go on?
[00:27:41 – 00:27:51]
Well, I, I like the having the mindset of curiosity, you know, going in when you, you talked about meeting people, like just be curious, you know, everybody’s.
[00:27:51 – 00:28:09]
Got a story, everybody’s got value, everybody’s got vulnerabilities that can make you heart centered to them or push you away. You’re looking for your tribe, you’re looking for your, your, your people. You don’t need a lot to have a satisfied, give a heck life. Right?
[00:28:09 – 00:28:10]
Yeah.
[00:28:10 – 00:29:02]
So it’s, you know, it’s so powerful to see how many boxes we ended up. We’d been talking about that self constructed or silent. Silently absorb people. What does that mean? Learn behavior. Everybody around you, you’re growing up. Your aunt, your uncle, maybe you’re close to the neighbor. They all have an influence on you, you may not realize. And they can be that person that’s helped create that box and you silently absorb yourself into it. It’s really hard, isn’t it, for us to define ourselves as a unique human being. I see it happen all the time where people will start being friends with somebody and they start mimicking their behaviors or their, or their laugh or their sense of humor. What’s, what’s your thoughts on that and why we as human beings tend to not be unique, but develop unique habits and behaviors from other people?
[00:29:03 – 00:30:07]
Well, I think mammals tend to mimic other mammals, you know, in their tribe because I think we are a tribal species and we have to, we have to be in a tribe to survive. You know, I just got back from South Africa and I am always reminded when I’m there, I love the animals. And it is so, it is so painfully obvious that riding solo in the jungle animal species, they don’t, they don’t survive. They will not survive on their own. If you are alone or injured, your days are numbered. And so we have to fit into some extent to have a tribe to be safe. I, I truly believe, I mean just, just you know, by, or how we were, I mean how we’ve been evolved that that is the case. And so my guess is, I mean, I’m not a scientist or anything like that in terms of human behavior, but my guess is it has something to do with that is it’s a, it’s underneath it all, it’s a survival mechanism. Them.
[00:30:08 – 00:31:42]
Oh definitely. And, and you know, like you said, you can’t survive on your own. Some people think they can together. We’re strong as a group. And now it’s finding that group, finding that, that group that will listen when they need to listen. They’ll give you advice when you need advice, as well as listen. And there’s the ones that’ll just be really blunt and give you that kick in the pants that you need. And creating those associations comes at a price. Creating those positive associations, people listening or watching, comes at a price. And here’s what I mean. You will start having people that you won’t offend intentionally, but they’re offended by your change, your growth. Why aren’t you hanging out with me as much? Oh, we were best friends. We used to get together on the weekends and do this and that and whatever addictive things they may have done and maybe not addictive. And literally you need to understand people listening or watching your associations. What you listen, watch who you hang out with is precious. Don’t discard the fact of how much power you have over your 6 inches between your ears and how much you can grow. So how are associations in your life? Did you, as you went through all this, transitions from, excuse me, from you know, pre med business and you know, just reinventing yourself. How did you, how did your associations change and what’s your thought process on how important our associations are with others?
[00:31:43 – 00:34:00]
Well, my associations changed dramatically because I moved from. So when I got divorced and laid off, I moved from Philadelphia back to my hometown. And when, when, when I tell people that they think I moved back to Gainesville, Florida, which I did, but I moved back to my childhood bedroom into my parents home with my two kids and I, My children were, were living in my, or sleeping in my sis. My what, what was my former sister’s bedrooms down the hall. And we were all, you know, and then I was in the room right next to my parents. I was 31. 32. 31 was 31. So my associations changed because I physically remove myself from the environment that I was in. But I did that very consciously because honestly I knew that if I was in the environment that I was in, I would have stayed in an unhealthy marriage. And I didn’t want that. So I needed to be out of that environment to, to have the support that I needed to get out of the marriage. So my associations, by design, I wanted them to be. I wanted a different reference group. But I think you bring up a good point. A lot of times we, we actually stay in these boxes because of fear of loss and these loss of social connections. Because anytime you Make a change in your life. It’s. I look at it almost like a chess game and you’ve moved a piece on the chessboard, so the entire game has changed. You’re going to upset some people. They’re going to be threatened, they’re going to be offended, they’re going to have an opinion about what you’re doing. And so your. Your relationships will change. That is a given. But I always say knowing that, be proactive. We’re a social species. We need connections. Sure. Up connections for your future self. That vision that you have for your future, where you’re going, the direction you’re moving towards, there are new people that would. That have that same energy and mindset that would love to be your friend. So create connections there, focusing on your future self and be okay with letting go of connections that helped you in the self that you are no longer or that you’ve.
[00:34:01 – 00:34:03]
You’ve grown out of.
[00:34:03 – 00:35:16]
Grown out of. Great. There’s a great book. I don’t know if you’ve read it, DWight, but it’s Dr. Henry McLeod’s necessary endings. And it really helped me because I used to. I used to be really uncomfortable with endings in relationships, whether they’re platonic or otherwise, because I felt like I had failed in some way. And I had this idea that relationships should last forever. And he really puts it into a great context where relationships, we are designed to have them. They. They teach us something about ourselves and, and when they’re finished teaching us, then we need to move on and they need to move on. And so it’s a natural, it’s an expectation, it’s natural for relationships to begin and to have endings. He relates it to pruning back a bush. And you know, every so often you need to prune back, you need to cut back the bush so that it can flourish and grow even bigger and stronger. And so that’s what we need to do with our relationships. And I never looked at it that way until I read that book. And it’s really helped me release the guilt that I felt when I no longer wanted to be in relationship with somebody.
[00:35:16 – 00:35:35]
That’s. Thank you for recommending that book. At the end of the day, mindset. In order to change our mindset, we need to do things we have to read, we have to do different practices. Were there other things you did besides that book that helped you and grounded you during the transitions through your life?
[00:35:37 – 00:38:24]
Yes. I mean, just different mindset shifts. You know, I used years ago, I mean, probably decades now, but I used to have a big fear of failure. And I real. And that was holding me back. And I realized, you know, failure is another box. It’s another label that we may choose to put on certain outcomes. And I decided that’s not. I don’t live in that box anymore. That does not exist in my life. And I truly don’t believe failure is in my life because I always say, okay, Betsy, what is the worst that can happen if I do X? The worst case is it doesn’t. The outcome is not what I had hoped. Okay. I’ve had a lot of outcomes that are not what I had hoped in my life. You know, when you, when you reach your 50s, I think most of us can say that. And I’m going to need to pivot. And I’ve had to pivot in my past. It didn’t kill me. And most importantly, I will have, I will have learned one, if not several things that I get to take with me for the rest of my life that make me stronger and better as a person. That’s worst case scenario. And research has shown worst case scenario happens 3% of the time. So that’s a risk that I’m willing to take. So that, that mindset shift really helped me address when I was feeling resistance to making a change because I thought I might, quote, unquote, fail. So that, that was a big one. That was life changing for me. So I, and I, I passed that on to my children. And it. You really become invincible when you release yourself of that option. And I’ve taught that to my agent. I have a real estate company. I taught that to my agents. You know, we actually call them learnings. And every Tuesday we have a team meeting, a company meeting, and we all bring our learnings in. And these are things that in other companies, you would probably hide the fact that you did this because you would be embarrassed that you forgot to put XYZ in a contract or, you know, some, some mistake that you made. We’re all human. We all make them. But by sharing them and what we learned from them, we. We see that everybody else grows and, and they’re. They are learning and growing exponentially because everyone in the group is sharing everything they learned in that in the last week. So it’s almost like a contest now who can outdo each other in terms of the learnings that we have in our, in our weekly meetings. So that was a, that was a really big one.
[00:38:24 – 00:38:27]
That’s a large pivot. That’s a big pivot.
[00:38:27 – 00:38:27]
Yeah.
[00:38:28 – 00:41:01]
Biggest pivot. Because, like, he Shared so much great knowledge and information. We go through the seasons of life with people and they, and we feel bad. I was terrible for that. Oh, I used to brag, I got this friend for 30 some years, yet they’re a boat anchor. They were literally an energy vampire in my life and I continue to stick up for them. And people in my tribe, and I’m part of their tribe, would be telling me, you know, why are you hanging out with that person? Well, we’ve been friends, so if they’re not serving you to grow and feel good about yourself. So that was about seven, eight years ago. And I share this on podcasts all the time, so I won’t get into details of it, but I, I, when I do lifestyle coaching, I have a process called the 7030 principle. And, and how I look at people now and how, and, and, and that 7030 principle, it’s emotional. How does it make me feel emotional? What are my physical trend? What are my physical triggers? Do I smile? Do I have a happy thought? Thinking he may have said something that wasn’t the greatest, but I can’t wait to see him again. Or if I, if I think more than once, if it’s 50% of the time, could be good, could be bad. Goodbye, you’re out of my tribe. I don’t care if you’ve been in my season since the day you were born. Yeah, you know, I’m going to leave. Respectfully. Sometimes you can’t. Some people get really irate and that’s just life. But so I really liked you talking about that and, and you know, you talked about your real estate group. That is so unique. Thank you for sharing that you’re a business owner or, you know, a mentor to people, telling them it’s okay to share what’s going on, your vulnerabilities. We’re going to celebrate the fact that you admitted you forgot to put this on a contract. Like, I thought that was amazing. That is so smart. And I deal with a lot. I’ve been coaching entrepreneurs and businesses for the now going on to 23 years that I’ve been in business doing my business and coaching people. And that’s one thing. Now I’m going to share with them. Hey, go listen to this podcast. You need to listen to Betsy. Like, that is awesome. Let’s celebrate not always our wins. Let’s celebrate our mistakes and somebody else in the room can learn from it. Now you become a stronger unity and the people in the room that don’t like that vulnerability are going to sneer. I would watch for that body language. You’re not part of this tribe. Why are you sneering? Because that person did that or thinking, ha ha, I’ve never done that. They don’t say it, but you can see it. Does that make sense?
[00:41:01 – 00:41:03]
Right. Yeah.
[00:41:03 – 00:41:03]
So.
[00:41:03 – 00:41:03]
Well, I have found.
[00:41:03 – 00:41:04]
Good for you.
[00:41:04 – 00:41:05]
It really builds the trust.
[00:41:06 – 00:41:08]
Oh, it’s awesome. I love that.
[00:41:08 – 00:41:10]
But can I just mention a couple of things that you just.
[00:41:11 – 00:41:12]
Absolutely. Sorry. Go ahead.
[00:41:12 – 00:41:22]
So I was thinking when you. When you were talking about that, debating whether you should keep somebody in your tribe, I always say, if it’s not a hard yes, it’s a no.
[00:41:24 – 00:41:25]
Short and sweet.
[00:41:25 – 00:41:27]
Yeah, right.
[00:41:27 – 00:41:28]
Short and sweet.
[00:41:28 – 00:43:27]
And then the other thing, when you mentioned your coaching about feelings. So one of the things that has come up repeatedly, people come to me and say, how do. How do I become more aware of boxes that are confining me and also, like people. Right. That are confining me. And so what I learned, and this was very difficult for me because I wasn’t raised like this. But you were talking about how you feel, getting in touch with my body and how I feel. How does this decision set sit with me? Because your body will tell you before your mind tells you if you listen to it. And so I have. There’s an app, it’s a free app called how We Feel. It’s fantastic. And so it. You can set it so that it’s free and you can set it to vibrate. It’s on your phone. You can vibrate. Whether you have, like, stressful times during the day or, you know, you have certain things that are going to happen during the day and it will check in with you. And you click the bubble on, you know, all these different bubbles. You pick the one that. That you’re feeling. And then if you want, you can write in who you’re with, what you’re doing and what environment you’re in, and you can start seeing the trends. Who’s bringing you down, who’s lifting you up, what environments weigh you down and what environments make you feel lighter and more free. So that’s been a wonderful thing for me as well as I. I literally printed out a feelings wheel, which is like a color wheel with feelings on it. Because when I started this journey, I didn’t even have that vocabulary. You know, I went to the therapist for the first time and. And she said, betsy, how do you feel? And I said, I feel pretty good. And she’s like, well, what other feelings do you. Do you experience? And I, I thought it was like a trick question. I’m like, well, I’ve. Sometimes I feel bad and she’s like, okay, and other, other, other feelings. And I really didn’t have any other vocabulary. I either felt good or I felt bad. And so that was a whole learning for me. I got, I bought the book Atlas of the Heart by Renee Brown. It’s basically an encyclopedia of any feeling you ever could experience.
[00:43:28 – 00:43:29]
She’s amazing.
[00:43:29 – 00:43:40]
Yes. And you know, once you have a name for it, it really helps you identify with it and understand it. So those are some resources that I have found helpful in my journey on getting more in touch with how I feel.
[00:43:41 – 00:46:38]
That’s fantastic because I find people listening and watching. I’ve had people reach out to me and say, well, when is ever going to be enough? Your development journey. Till the day I take my last breath. What do you mean? Well, I always want to constantly evolve. If I enter life real thinking or finish the last part of my life, 30, 40 years, or whatever the case may be, if, if I don’t think I can learn from others that they don’t have something magical that hasn’t come out of their mouth yet. And I think I’m, I’m all that. My life’s on a hamster wheel and I coach on that all the time. Go to work, go home, get paid. Whether it’s a company, whether it’s private, you’re a career driven person. At the end of the day, I relish and I literally embrace change and acceptance of others because I’m more, I find myself personally more I accept others. The more they accept me, the more genuine I am with them and the more I am cognizant of my behaviors, my body language, and not being afraid to say to others, Betsy, that, you know what, I got something going on right now. And I just, I’m not quite engaged with what you’re saying. And I believe you deserve the 100% of me. And right now you’re not getting it. Can we delay this conversation? Can we have this later? We have it tomorrow. I promise you we will have it. But right now I just have something else that’s come up. I. That’s how I raise my kids. They come into the house and, you know, okay, I could. Let’s, let’s talk right now. Dad’s just in the middle of something, right. And I’m sorry, I just don’t have the mental capacity for you and. Can we talk later? Sometimes it would. Okay, dad, thanks. Other times it would be, nah, you Know what I mean? But, but that’s how I learned how to navigate the intensity of people that don’t have the emotional IQ that an adult supposed to have, not always has, but supposed to have. And I learned to be a better dad, a better friend, a better parent, and learn to be more of a student of human nature. They’re all adults now. The youngest is 26 year old. This is going to be 39 this year. So at the end of the day, I tried my best, but they were my, they were my, I want to say project, but they were my sounding board. They were my, I was just. I’m going to try this and see how it works on younger people. Everybody’s always wanting to coach the older people. What about we start at a younger age? What about we start right in school? What’s your thoughts on that and how we need to educate, you know, the youth of our world today. Right. Like you talked about doing things with your family and I made mistakes. You know what, though? People listening, watching, I admit them to my kids, even today, if it comes up or something that I have a realization, I communicate with them. Yeah, right. Sorry I did that. Dad wasn’t the best. Don’t do that.
[00:46:39 – 00:50:30]
Yeah, no, no, I’m the same way. I’m, I’m very real with my children. I was when they were, they’re 20s, they’re about to turn 26, and one’s 27. I have two daughters. I, you know, it’s funny because, like the first five or six years of their life, I was very much a helicopter parent. You know, I could feel myself kind of raising them the way I was raised where, I mean, and I had a great childhood. I’m not saying I didn’t, but, but my parents were very, very involved in everything. So, you know, there wasn’t a spelling test that I wasn’t quizzed on 10 times before I took it. You know, I, my, my mother knew every test I had to take. My dad quizzed me on math and science. My mother did the English and grammar stuff. And, you know, I remember going to college wondering if I could do it because I had all this support at home and I was going away to college and I would, I wouldn’t have this backup support. And when my daughter, when my one daughter was in first grade, I remember we, she had just had her first project to take home, a weekend project. And it was, you know, the whole poster board collage. Pick a person, a famous person that inspires you. And she picked Rosa Parks. And we spent the weekend on that poster. And, and really, I spent the weekend on the poster. I mean, I made sure it looked perfect going in, and I carried it in for her because I didn’t want it to get dirty. And I remember waiting for. In line with the kids, and Mrs. Walton was in the front of the classroom, and all these kids were holding their posters so proudly, beaming. And I was looking at their posters and some were torn and dirty and handwriting going, you know, down a mountain slope, you know, hadn’t been properly done and misspellings and photo slapped on sideways. And I remember saying to myself, how could a mother send that poster in? And then I looked at my daughter and she was not smiling, she wasn’t proud because she didn’t do this poster. And I was like. I said to myself, what am I doing? You know, what. What am I hoping for? You know, that. And I think I was overcompensating because I did feel some guilt that I was a single parent. And I wanted to make sure that that teacher knew that she came from a home, that her mother was involved and cared about and, you know, wanted excellence. But I, I did a. A180 that day, and I went cold turkey. And I said, from here on out, the children are going to do everything on their own. Like, everything that they’re able to do on their own. And. Because I want to. Because at the end of the day, I said, what is the long term goal here? I, I don’t care about the grade. I want them to be independent, confident, contributing members of society. And so then I remember, I, I would just say, you know, they would come to me and I would always say, I don’t know, but I know you’ll figure it out. And I must have said that, I don’t know, ten times a day. And I remember just the other day, I was talking to one of my daughters who, they’re in their later 20s now, and I remember saying, what are you gonna do? Like, I was, they were. We were on the phone and I was like, wow, wonder what they’re gonna do. I said, what are you gonna do? And she said, I don’t know, mom, but I’ll figure it out. And it, it brought me such joy to know that, because that’s what I want. That’s. That was my goal. And I’m so glad that I recognized it. When Maria was in first grade, Elena was in kindergarten, because I was on a path to. On a very different path. And I, I got a lot of criticism. I got, you know, I was Got kicked out of the good mom box a lot because.
[00:50:30 – 00:50:31]
Oh, gosh.
[00:50:32 – 00:51:31]
Yeah. I mean, if. If my child left their lunch on the counter. I mean, I lived a mile from school. It stayed on the counter. I wasn’t driving it to school, and I love my children, but. But I knew that if I drove it to school, what would that teach them? And, you know, they only did that once. Each of them did it once, and then they didn’t forget again. But I remember that first time the school. The lady called me from school and said, the child’s lunch is on. You know, Maria said she forgot her lunch. And I said, yep, she did. And they said, well, will you bring it? Does she have money? I’m like, nope. But, you know, it’s only going to be a couple of hours. She won’t do it again. And I remember that the lady was judging me and it. And so that was hard because I did some things that were not in the mainstream of parenting at the time. But I’m so happy that. I mean, not that I didn’t make mistakes. I did. But in that area, I absolutely feel like I. I did the right decision. And they’re. They’re both so confident and just so independent and happy adults.
[00:51:32 – 00:54:43]
That’s awesome. We’ve got so many commonalities. It’s not. It’s not even funny. My. I did. I did the sitting at the table helping. What do they call it, where we had to do this picture thing for my one daughter, and we had to buy clay. And, like, it is supposed to portray a scene. I can’t think of the name of what they call them in school. She was in junior high, like, middle school. And. Yeah. And I remember I was sold. No, we have to put the little tree this way, and we got to do this way. We got to create the hill this way. And at the end of the day, we got it to school. We got it done a couple days later. And I didn’t. I wasn’t a clay person. It all cracked and stuff, and. And she took. And she caught. She thought it was kind of, oh, my gosh, what’s gonna happen? And she got a good mark on it. She took it in. But I also realized, not the same realization as you, that she. Your daughter, didn’t have a smile on her face. I just realized that, you know, if I’m going to help her for everything so she doesn’t stumble and fall, what’s going to happen to her as an adult now? She’s a very successful. This one daughter. They’re all successful in her own right. But this one daughter that I’m talking about, she’s a successful nurse, Travel nurses down in the US too. Like she lives in, in my home province of Alberta, in Calgary. She goes down. She just, she was in Seattle for three months. Travel nursing. Plus she nurses here, but she’s just a go getter. She hit high school, that same girl, because I stopped helping her so much. She hit high school, had honors, was in two different. She was in dance. She was in two different dance troops. She was in the school’s dance program. She went to a performing arts school and she was just, she just like, I can do it on my own. I can figure this out. And now that’s many years later. She turns 30 this year. And you know, it’s just amazing when I look at my kids and the journey they’ve gone through, I made mistakes. We have conversations. Just own up to your mistakes, people. Your kids want to be worthy in your eyes and you want to be worthy in theirs. Don’t kid yourself. You want them to look at you still as that hero when they were a little kid. It’s a total different hero worship. It’s called respect, Right. They respect the fact that you’re letting them grow, but they know if your things go wrong, they can call you. That’s the way I developed myself and continue to develop myself as a single parent because I went through it, right? But I went through with five of them. I had joint custody and then one of them went out on her own when she was 7, 16, 17. But then I got full time custody of all four of the three of the girls and my son and raised him as a single dad. I was judged by everybody. So I get what you were saying. I was, I was stuck in, I was stuck into. The parents would avoid me. It was sad. I’d go to the kids schools and they’d avoid me, right? And they, they never even asked me. They just assumed that I was a bad person. Right. Because our society automatically looked at the woman and said he’s the fault. Right?
[00:54:43 – 00:54:44]
Yeah.
[00:54:44 – 00:55:36]
And then I grew, started growing over the years from them going through elementary, junior high, high school and tons of those parents I still communicate with, they still know me or will run into one another. Oh, you were always the greatest dance dad. You’re always, always the greatest. Gymnastics, soccer, everything. Because I was chasing up to everything and there, and there was a tribe of people that respected me then, didn’t judge me and didn’t make assumptions about me so hard to find nowadays, when you go through, even today, going through divorce, women and men, you know, don’t judge one another until you honestly have walked a mile in their shoes. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Don’t let the other parent tell you what that parent’s like. Yeah, right. Go up and say, hi. Yeah, hi, Betsy. I’m Dwight. Pleasure to meet you. And if they scowl at you, then turn around, walk off.
[00:55:36 – 00:55:36]
Yeah.
[00:55:39 – 00:55:46]
Yeah. So being a single parent, his character building, but, man, was it rewarding as well. Right?
[00:55:46 – 00:55:47]
Yeah.
[00:55:47 – 00:56:10]
I look at this many years later, all my kids still communicate with me. All my kids still ask certain amount of advice. Sometimes they don’t. Then they wish they would have and whatever. That’s. That’s the journey of life. People smile, you’re going to cry, you’re going to yell, you’re going to scream, you’re going to have some angry moments. But life is in session. This is not a dress rehearsal. Right. Work on yourself. Right.
[00:56:10 – 00:56:11]
Yeah.
[00:56:11 – 00:56:29]
So one of the things that, you know, your definition of success is obviously evolved through everything that you’ve shared with us today. Have you, as your definition of success since you started living more authentically over the years, changed than what it was when you were younger?
[00:56:30 – 00:57:10]
Yeah. Yeah. When I was younger, I was always going after the next promotion, the next. When I was in pharma, it was always the next promotion or the next pay increase. When I first started real estate, it was, you know, the accolades, the being recognized regionally or nationally for our sales. But over the years, it definitely has changed. I created a nonprofit. My goal daily is, you know, my. My measure of success. And I ask myself this every evening. Did my presence enhance someone’s life today? And if it did, then I had a successful day. And that’s very different than the way I was living, you know?
[00:57:11 – 00:58:34]
Yeah, no, that’s. That’s good, though. I like to hear that. The reason I asked that question is the evolution. If we have to realize our evolution and when we accept the fact and are aware of where we’re going, when you get there, it’s. It’s more satisfying too, when we, you know, I never, ever thought I accomplished. Could accomplish that because all these naysayers said I couldn’t. Or me having imposter syndrome. I’m telling myself this stuff. I look in the mirror and go, like, why would that person want to work with me? Or why would they want me to help them? And really, we need to understand that we are all worthy individuals. Right. We just need to Find our tribe. Find the people that resonate with you and work at one person at a time. Quit trying to do it all at once when you’re, when you’re pivoting and growing. I love that word, pivot. You, of course, a question I was going to ask you about it, but again, you know, there’s just so much I could ask you. But we’re going to get to a point of wrapping up this show. This conversation has been so powerful. I really appreciate it, everything that you shared. Before we wrap up though, what final message would you message would you like to share with the listeners or people watching who are just beginning to question the boxes they’re in? I need a reminder to keep giving a heck and never giving up.
[00:58:36 – 00:59:19]
Yeah, I mean, like I said, you know, exploring what boxes are no longer serving you. Get in touch with your emotions and your feelings. That’s going to be your first sign. And trust them. That was hard for me to do at the beginning is to trust them and then try to, you know, discern what major fear is holding you back. Whether it’s fear of failure, fear of loss, you know, loss of social connection, loss of status, loss of financial security, or fear of change, and then address those head on. I think that’s what’s helped me move towards leading a more authentic and fulfilling life.
[00:59:19 – 00:59:25]
Wow, that, that is so true. I appreciate that. So what’s next for you, Betsy?
[00:59:26 – 01:00:05]
You know, I, I’m actually still trying to figure that out. I’m. I’m contemplating writing a second book, a follow up book. I just created a course that complements the first book, but there has been a request for, for further exploration of the topic, so I might do that. I’ve been doing a lot of speaking both in person and on podcasts, and I’m also looking to do some collaborations with, on the real estate side, nothing to do with this kind of personal journey, but also on the real estate side, doing some collaborations with my competitors and creating products that will serve the industry.
[01:00:06 – 01:00:44]
That’s amazing. So on top of all this, you want to better your industry, which is. That’s admirable. That’s amazing. Like, so many people are like, we don’t want to share this. We don’t want to work with that person. They’re going to steal this, they’re going to steal that, they’re going to take my idea. You know what, we’re supposed to support one another in life. Come on. People, people that are interested in me aren’t going to necessarily like Betsy or people are Like Betsy aren’t going to necessarily like me and maybe they like us both, but Betsy’s got, you know, more of a, you know, happy, go, lucky personality. But that’s okay. We don’t have to always be in competition mode, right?
[01:00:44 – 01:00:51]
No, I, I believe in abundance, not scarcity. And I believe if I put that out, that’s what comes back.
[01:00:51 – 01:01:00]
Absolutely. So where can people connect with you? And grab also a copy of Breaking Boxes, Dismantling the metaphorical boxes that bind us.
[01:01:01 – 01:01:19]
I am so easy to find. It’s my name. So my name is Betsy Pepin. So I have a website, Betsy Papin.com I’m on all the social platforms with my name at Betsy Pepin. My book is on Amazon and all the major book retailers online as well as available on my website, Betsy Pepin dot com.
[01:01:20 – 01:02:46]
Fantastic. Those new to the Give a Heck podcast, go to give a heck.com go to the top hit podcast. You’ll see a picture of Betsy and you will see detailed show notes as well as the full unedited transcript of the show. If you want to look up something that was said, not have to listen to, you can go read it. You can, you can actually, it’s broken down by segments, really easy to go through. Plus all the links for Betsy’s social media. Her website will be there as well. So just go to giveaheck.com so Betsy, thank you for showing up with us. Honesty, heart and hope. Your story is a reminder that we don’t have to stay stuck in the roles we’ve outgrown. Right? And it’s never too late to rewrite that script. So to everyone listening, if something in this conversation stirred you, something in you personally, don’t ignore it. Take that first baby step. There is people, such amazing people like Betsy and myself that can support you to help you give a hack and live with purpose. Right. And with intent. So really, again, please, please give a heck about yourself. We do. You just have to reach out so we can support you through your into your purpose and having freedom. Freedom of the shackles that society and the boxes that we put ourselves into has slowed us down and made us live a life of just linear and not growth. Any last final words before I close off the show?
[01:02:48 – 01:02:52]
No, I feel like we’ve covered the topic well.
[01:02:52 – 01:03:29]
I appreciate you. This has been fantastic. So I’m gonna wrap up now, listeners. Betsy is amazing. If you are a person that likes YouTube, go watch it. This is because then you can see people’s mannerisms, their body language. That’s got a beautiful glasses, a great smile. Right? There you go. So go take a look. Don’t take my word for it. So thanks so much for being on Give a Hack. Betsy. I appreciate your time and sharing some of your experiences so that others too can learn. It is never too late to give a heck.